Protowrxs Intro...

[protowrxs]

Guess one is pretty required to post an intro to eventually be able to see anything??

Anyhow, Looks like there should be some good info in regard to engine and drive lines that I could educate myself between here and Heymow.

What I've build is not a racer or a ATLM I guess but a Karted version. Old 19hp flat Craftsman, some 1 1/8" and 1 1/2" tubing and time with the results of this;


Works great but it's time to speed things up. Swapped a 5" motor / 3" transaxle pulley but with a 13:1 final and limited RPM it's still pretty slow.

Maybe there's a forum out there for this type of stuff? I haven't had much luck finding anything yet.

-Stephen

[mtd]

welcome to the sight...Looks like u got ur self a pretty cool homemade cart there.What kind of tranny are you using?

[protowrxs]

Thanks.. it was a learning project on pipe bending, welding, and was fun to build. It's for our son who is 12 now... wanted a kart when he was 10, took me this long to get it done. 

The transaxle is a Peerless/Tecumseh unit. I haven't checked for the actual model yet. That is what I am looking at right now is transaxle options or mods to gear up without more pulley replacements. For this app I prefer a transaxle just for ease of setup but might have to do something different in the long run. Originally I had calculated it would run 30+ mph with the pullies and gearing I have in it at 3500rpm but it's not living up to that. Need to get a tach and find the real RPM on the motor is I guess and go from there.

Any suggestions?

-Stephen

[Chris]

Welcome man!

I checked out your website when you signed up, Ryf has a kart very similar to yours - he'll probably check in here sometime soon.

Not too sure how you'd get that transaxle spinning faster without another pulley swap though.

[mtd]

Well if you have an 820 series peerless you can get the 017 kit which is a new set of gears to put in the transaxle to speed it up without over driving it.Which means if u overdrive it after installing that you get even more speed.

[protowrxs]

Thanks for the welcome

I do need to track down the actual trans model this weekend. I guess I also need to validate the gov and throttle are working properly as well. Anyhow have any specifics on gov adjustments online? I imagine that would be in a Briggs manual as well but I haven't tracked one down yet.

I have seen the gear kit on ebay. That makes sense but maybe for the money I should look at other options.

I trying to find more info in regard to final drive ratios for the various transaxles out there.

I'll keep searching away for now I guess.

Thanks again
-Stephen
Posted on: November 15, 2007, 06:06:36 PMFYI the AustinNolen.com site is my son's.

All my crap (chopper bikes, Stang, Motorcycles, etc) is linked through http://www.StephenNolen.com and my Protowrxs.com site.

-Stephen

One last thing, here is the trans - I never could find #'s on the thing when it was out:
http://www.austinnolen.com/GoKart/P0002621_Medium.JPG

[mtd]

The model number should be right under the brake disc.You should be able to see it without removing the disc.

[Taylor]

protowrxs , Thats a pretty darn cool thing you got there.... How does it handle with it kinda of high in the back?

Taylor

[protowrxs]

Thanks Taylor. We don't have a lot of hours on it yet but so far so good.

The rear part of the thing is from the front of 1/2 of the original mower so the swivel is still there. The rear can twist AND moves up and down with the shocks so it is pretty flexible and "twistable". With the long wheel base I felt it needed some twist.

I have hammered it trying to do a donut actually trying to turn it over and haven't been able to yet. (I did manage to slide out of the seat though) ... BUT it still is not very fast with a 5" / 3.5" pulley combo and a 13:1 final tranny ratio. It's fun to cruise around in though... just need to get more speed out of it now. Part of the reason I am here.

I need to insure the gov is setup properly since I know it has been messed with in the past and plan on gearing up some more.

The complete build is here on my son's site if anyone is interested;
http://www.austinnolen.com/GoKart

-Stephen

[Taylor]

Have you tried changing the pulleys to 6" and "3?

Taylor

[mtd]

If you are only getting 15 mph with a 5 on motor and 3.5 on trans your motor is not governed high enough.It should be 3650rpm at full throttle.

[protowrxs]

Thanks.. 6 or 6.5 and 3 is the next attempt on the pulleys but I do believe the gov is holding down RPM. Need to get a tach and check it still. Also I cannot find any good specific info on adjusting the gov on this motor (42A707 twin flat) so I am left to figure it out myself.

Thanks for the info and tips!

-Stephen

[Taylor]

Check ina briggs manual.... Thats usually says.....

[STEELMAN]

welcome stephen.
 im pretty familiar with those motors (i have about 6 of them) and will tell you "DO NOT GO OVER 4000 RPM" they are famous for seizing the top rod also run your oil on the high side never low and last of all if you want to make this motor insane say maybe 50 horse and 5000 rpm or somewhere in that zone talk to don at g-team www.g-team.us

[protowrxs]

welcome stephen.
 im pretty familiar with those motors (i have about 6 of them) and will tell you "DO NOT GO OVER 4000 RPM" they are famous for seizing the top rod also run your oil on the high side never low and last of all if you want to make this motor insane say maybe 50 horse and 5000 rpm or somewhere in that zone talk to don at g-team www.g-team.us

Thanks for the tips and info! Guess I better figure out a tach before doing too much then.

Yeah, I found Don G's site.. way out there. I'd be better off with a motorcycle engine though for that money.

-Stephen

[STEELMAN]

cheapest out there is called a vibratach im pretty sure.

[Taylor]

Northerntool has a vibratach for $40.00.

[protowrxs]

If I'm going to spend the money I'd still like to have a tach up by the steering wheel. Looks like everything is digital display though. I'm still toying with adapting an automotive tach using a mag sensor on the flywheel to trigger the tach input.

The more I've messed with the engine the more it seems like it is leaning out and running out of gas. If you actually hold it full throttle very long it spins up and then eventually dies out. Pulling the choke when it's dying brings it back to life. I've checked the gas tank vent so far and need to make sure the diaphragm pump is working properly. The engine sat for a couple years and has never had a carb kit to my knowledge so that may need to be addressed as well.

Thanks again for the info and tips!
-Stephen

[tractorman]

It sounds like you need a carb kit always better to be safe then sorry! Also are you sure your not getting to much air/fuel mixture? Problably getting to much air and and not enough gas..

TM

[tntchitwood]

Stephen,     When you figure out the fuel problem could you let us know? I have been running one of my mowers with the choke half on to keep it running. I have not rebuilt the fuel pump yet, but I have changed the fuel lines and the in line filter. No help.It looks like we have the same motor though. Thanks,and good luck,   Tom

[protowrxs]

I can't adjust it out using the air/fuel mixture screw and I'm sure it needs a carb kit so that is on the list for this next week. Will post if that resolves the issue. Thanks

[tractorman]

So you cant adjust it heh? I think that you need to talk to Don G. over at G-team racing he may have something that you can somehow change it to be adjustable...

TM

[protowrxs]

No.. sorry. I should have been more clear.

I CAN adjust the idle/air and get results but cannot get the motor to run full throttle without what appears to be running out of fuel. I need to get the carb rebuilt and fuel supply lined out first before moving on to anything else. Plan on picking up a carb kit this week, pull it apart, clean and rebuild and go from there.

[tractorman]

Okay that sounds good then... Once you do that and it still acts up try this~~ Hold it down at full throttle and adjust it while its wide open....

TM

[protowrxs]

Okay that sounds good then... Once you do that and it still acts up try this~~ Hold it down at full throttle and adjust it while its wide open....

TM

Yeah.. tried that... won't clean up, does the same thing. Thanks for the information. What is the starting point for the setting? 1 turn out, 1 1/2?


Obviously I do need to pickup a engine manual as well.

-Stephen

[mtd]

Should be around 1 1/4 to 1 1/2 turns.Hope this helps.

[tractorman]

Yup just like MTD said..

TM

[Chris]

Strange, sounds like the problem I was having with whatever engine I stuck on the back of my Toro. Would run great for a little while, than just die like it was being starved for fuel... I never did get that problem solved...

[protowrxs]

Strange, sounds like the problem I was having with whatever engine I stuck on the back of my Toro. Would run great for a little while, than just die like it was being starved for fuel... I never did get that problem solved...

How encouraging.. lol - I believe I can figure it out. Found the carb kit #'s - Will check out locally to see who has it.

-Stephen

[Chris]

Yeah, never got the problem fixed becuase I ended up putting a nice 45* bend in my axle... Completely tore down the mower to re-build everything than bought a 4WD truck that has become a money/time pit...

[STEELMAN]

I have been round and round with this problem and the best answer i can give is at one point and time for whatever reason i cant remember the carbs were changed so they only had one adjustment screw so if the carb air cleaner etc... is not perfectly clean or the weather is not correct (i believe Chris was having problems with his twin in the winter like me) they will not run properly. i will try to call g-team tomorrow and see what don has to say (he has been studying twins quite a bit lately from what i hear.

[protowrxs]

Just an update...
Got a carb kit, worked with my 12 year old son to rebuild it as a lesson.
Fired it up and appears it would run on out now.

Backed it out for a spin and popped the starter gear off the top of the starter. lol

Tried to get it back together but the top washer is cracked and slipping over the clip.
Have another started on the way. Hopefully it will get here soon.

Can't win...
-Stephen

[tntchitwood]

Stephen,
               Did you ever get that thing lined out?  I still have not on my yard mower. Cleaned the carb, it looks like a shiny new penny, inside and out. Won't start without priming the carb, then runs sketchy. New fuel line and filter, cleaned air filter, new gas. What all is in a carb kit? Any parts for the fuel pump? I don't think it is the carb, but maybe the pump. Help!?!?                 Tom

[Taylor]

Tom, I beileve you have to buy a fuel pump kit seprate from the carb kit... Last time I checked for my kohler thats what I had to do...

Taylor

[protowrxs]

The carb kit they sold me was not the exact one for my carb. I had to reuse the top gasket but it was in good shape.
It DID come with a new diaphragm and springs for the fuel pump.

We finally did get a starter, got it running again in the garage and then was hit with an ice storm and power outages last week so I haven't tried running it out yet. It's been in the 30's most of the time and dark when I get home. I hate this time of the  year project wise. :-(

I did read somewhere else that someone had a similar problem and there was some small debris in the main jet keeping the flow down. I could not get the cover nut off the main jet on the bench and left it but that is the next thing I am going to check if the rebuild didn't work. I have family coming in for Christmas Saturday but took off Friday so hopefully my son and I will mess with it then. It's supposed to be nice weather finally as well.

Will report back soon
-Stephen

[tntchitwood]

I guess I will get that pump rebuild kit. The carb is perfect inside.Carb cleaner and compressed air,does the trick every time.

[protowrxs]

Just an update of some sorts.
The carb kit did seem to help. I also re-adjusted the gov and am now getting about 3,000 rpm out of it. Also figured out that the existing shift linkage was not going into 6th gear. Ended up with about 18mph now... but with the horsepower/torque it gets there VERY fast... It should still be faster on paper but I am not worrying too much about that for now since it still only has the transaxle rear brake.

I also re-adjusted the throttle linkage to get the idle correct and full throttle and fixed the throttle pedal to feel better. Also put some mufflers on it.. way to annoying to ride very much like that to me (an the neighbors too I would guess).

Here's a little vid;

[Chris]

Sounds like you might have a bad coil... Seems like it's only running on one cyl most of the time...

[tntchitwood]

That thing is pretty awesome. Looks cool!

[money89tractors]

I tend to agree with Chris thats its not firing in both cylinders all the time. Pull the plugs and see if theyre gapped right, you might even try just replacing them. If that doesnt help, try another coil.

question: after you run it for a long period of time and the engine is good and hot,shut it off and try to start it again. If it seems to have trouble starting again its the coil going bad.

-Phil

[Taylor]

I agree with Phil and Chris sounds like you have a coil going bad.....

Taylor

[Chris]

That's how my Wizard ran, then it started stranding me everywhere... Then it just up and wouldn't start anymore. I replaced the coil and SHAZAM! It ran like a raped ape. Had much more power too.

That thing is cool though, I need to build myself a buggy!

[money89tractors]

That thing is cool though, I need to build myself a buggy!

You need to build El Toro, the Wizard, the S10, and the recovery mower first  lol

-Phil

[Chris]

You need to build El Toro, the Wizard, the S10, and the recovery mower first  lol

-Phil

[MOWchanic]

HAHA LOL! Chris you have too many projects!

[Chris]

HAHA LOL! Chris you have too many projects!

Oh you seriously have no idea!

[MOWchanic]

Oh you seriously have no idea!

  There cant be more!!! 

[Chris]

2 golf carts, 2 mowers, a dirtbike and my truck... Then there's the recovery mower build that I'll get around to one day :biggrin:

[MOWchanic]

Man.... You shure do have alot of things to work on.... But I thought the TORO was all together? Or did something happen?

Tyler

[speeddemon0308]

yup.. definaltly your coil....

[Chris]

Man.... You shure do have alot of things to work on.... But I thought the TORO was all together? Or did something happen?

Tyler

Completely tore it down to build it back up again a little beefier.

[protowrxs]

Thanks for the info on the coil. It's sounds the same as it always did in the original mower so it may have been a problem for a long time. Never had any hot start issues, new plugs, gapped on install so I doubt that is what it is. Suggested sources for a coil? It is the 'magnatron' I believe, no points.
Thanks
-Stephen

[money89tractors]

It is the electronic "magentron" whatever coil lol

a good place for one will be ebay, theyre pretty cheap. You can also look at the local junk yard.

-Phil

[Chris]

Personally, I wouldn't bother with a used one. They're cheap enough new ($40) to not chance it.

[speeddemon0308]

a buddy bougth a new one.. 90$ from briggs... and his mower ran WAYY better

[Chris]

Wow, $90?!?!! That's a bit much.

[speeddemon0308]

sure is.. and the funny thing is he dident get to use it.. he ran it for a little.. and then he blew it up ( siezed it ) haha!