locking transaxle tips

[tntchitwood]

hello all,
          Just a little tip for the new guys. I am new myself and have discovered a few things that may help a new guy but may be rather remedial to the veteran atlm'ers, therefore I put it here for the new guys.. When welding up the rear axle, first clean the gears and case very well. All the slag and junk from welding will stick in this old greasy mess. I weld the axle while it is laying in the case to keep it straight. Weld the spider gears( the little ones on the end of the axle) to the ring gear(big one). After welding, spin the axle to make sure nothing(like too much weld) is hitting the case. If so clean it off with a grinder. Clean everything again and put it back together with fresh grease.
   Attention:The brass bushings that are on the ends of the shafts that the gears are on have little tits and grooves in the case that keep the bushings from spinning in the case( I did not know that till today). It will lock up and bust the case if these are not lined up(I KNOW).
     Every transaxle I have taken apart has had at least one bolt under the input shaft pully. If you cannot get this pulley off, drill a hole in the pully above the bolt to get a socket on the bolt.
     After removing pulleys, hubs, etc. always use "anti sieze compound" on the shafts when reinstalling them,(ask at your local parts house).
     I hope these tips may help somebody along the line. If not, sorry I took up this space.                                                  Tom

[ryf]

that is good info, I especially like the drilling the hole in the pulley part, good idea (I use a automotive pulley puller, this usually ruins most sheet steel pulleys)

[Chris]

Definitely good info!

[MTDrider1160]

Maybe this could be accompied by pictures?

[tntchitwood]

I will have to take pictures of one I have already welded up, as I have welded them all up already, and try to figure out the posting of pictures. I will study into it, I saw it somewhere around here. Hope to do so soon.
                              Tom

[MTDrider1160]

If you want to email me the pictures I can upload them for you.  Email is> yamaharider5689@yahoo.com

[Chris]

I will have to take pictures of one I have already welded up, as I have welded them all up already, and try to figure out the posting of pictures. I will study into it, I saw it somewhere around here. Hope to do so soon.
                              Tom

http://www.offroadmowers.com/uploader/



Here's a walkthrough on how to use it. It's for my other site, but it's the same picture upload script.

http://www.theimportkiller.com/forums/index.php?topic=276.0

[tntchitwood]

MTDRider,     I sent those pictures through an E-mail. It took two tries and now I have a headache. I have registered to upload pictures but have not been OK'd yet. Hope the e-mail thing works, Thanks for your help in this matter. I will be picture savvy one of these days.  Thanks again.

[MTDrider1160]

Oops.  I thought they were spam.

[tntchitwood]

seriously? It will be easier to send now that I know how. Do you want them again or just wait on the uploader?
Posted on: July 29, 2007, 06:07:06 AMTest..........I may have figured out photobucket

[MTDrider1160]

Youve gotten through the hardest part.  Now in your photobucket album under the picture there should be a checkbox.  check it.  then scroll down to the bottom of the page where it says "generate HTML code" click that.  On the next page click in the box where it says clickable thumbnails for message boards"  copy whats in the box then paste it on here.  And that should do it.

[tntchitwood]

I did that, did a fairly nice write-up I thought and hit post.   The whole thing is gone now. I can,t find it. Should I try it again or do you think it is here somewhere?
Posted on: July 29, 2007, 08:14:07 AMHere they are, of course they are backwards  , just start at the bottom and go up. If anybody has any questions let me know. My test picture above is of the inside of a typical hydro.




The two holes drilled in this top pulley are for an automotive steering wheel type puller (Not the claw/arm type). They don't distort the pulley. I got tired of messing with it and just drilled one of the holes bigger so I could get a socket on the bolt underneath through the pulley.


Slots in the casing.

"Tits" on the bushings, must aligh with slits on case when reassembling.



The next three pictures show weld points. Be sure to spin axle to check for binding from excess weld.Grind excess weld for clearance.



All clean.



Use a scraper and degreaser to get out what you can.

These Two pics are of a freshly opened up transaxle.

[MTDrider1160]

Now you got um!!  I have a foote transaxle that i want to lock and this helps me out.  but just to double check- your welding the 2 spider gears that are on the axle- you weld the one to the drive gear and the other to the cage?  And it looks like those are stick welder beads, what rod are you using?  Will 6011 work on electrode negative?

[tntchitwood]

Correct on welding the spiders to the cage and ring gear.   My welder is a lincoln flux core welder.     .035" wire. I would say any type of welder you are comfy with will work. The pieces to be welded are very thick. I don't think you will hurt them.    The last one I welded was a foote. The case was tight around the diff which caused me to have to grind away some of my weld for clearance. Just remember to let everything cool and spin it while it is laying in the case. If there is any problem you will see it.

[tractorman]

cant see the pictures I get a red x?

[MTDrider1160]

cant see the pictures I get a red x?

Must be your server, i can see them fine.

Ok I didnt realize that my foote was alot different so I need some guidance as were to weld.






 

[tractorman]

Okay now I can see them. Question for you tntchitwood, I have always messed with wheel horses but I am going to build a second. In a peerless 600 or foote can you make one big locker? By taking the existing bull gear and the spider gears and adding 2 in the bull gear and welding the spider gears to the axle and welding everything together in the bull gear?

[Chris]

Sorry about not approving your account, I'm never online on the weekends

Seems like you got your post back, and that's one really good writeup!

Oh, and we probably have the same welder. HD100 I take it?

[creepycrawler]

I have a few tips to add, I have locked up many a tranny, including foote, peerless and spicer, also the tranny in a sears suburban and a allis chalmers garden tractor. the way Ive had most success with is only welding the two spider gears that are not on the axles, the ones that ride on the same 5/8 shaft. I clean the differential with carb cleaner then tack the two gears to the shaft. then I completely remove the tacked piece and arc weld the gears to the shaft. The benifits of this is that it is removable and can be put in another rearend if you burn one up. also it takes out the chance that you dont get the axleshafts perfectly true. Ie cause the rearend to lock up.

[MTDrider1160]

Anybody know how I could lock my foote?

[Chris]

With one of these?

[tractorman]

 

So when I go to weld my spider gears to the axles should I lay the axles in the one half of the case or not?

[tntchitwood]

I wish I could help. Maybe it is your browser settings or something to that effect. Maybe somebody who knows will respond.?
Posted on: July 31, 2007, 04:19:53 PMWhat happened?  I guess I am behind!!!!! LOL
Posted on: July 31, 2007, 04:22:01 PMMTDRider............ The spider gears that are directly inside the ring gear.......Weld them to the ring gear so they will not spin inside the ring(bull) gear. It is tight between the case and the ring gear so some of your weld will have to be cleaned up with a grinder for clearance. Footes are a little tougher, same principal.
Posted on: July 31, 2007, 04:27:41 PMTractorman...........I am not that familiar with the wheelhorse transaxles, but I have heard of people doing this with the extra gears.I have never done it that way and don't know why anybody would, I'm sure people have their reasons. The way I do it if you happen to snap the axle or something similar, there is the possibility of changing the axle. Also there is minimal welding and it is very easy.....Plus, I don't have to find an extra set of spider gears. I live by the rule.....Keep it simple stupid.(Me not you....)   Try it different ways and let us know how it goes. Maybe a comparison. Take pictures though I would like to see one done this way.        Tom
Posted on: July 31, 2007, 04:40:13 PMTractorman...I lay mine in the case to keep them true and straight. I would recommend doing the same.   Sorry about not getting back sooner. I have been checking the board daily(10 times a day) and tonight the rest of the thread finally loaded.?????? Stupid PC.
Posted on: July 31, 2007, 04:46:30 PMI see what happened. There is a second page to this thread. DUH!!!!  Stupid Human!!!!!
Posted on: July 31, 2007, 04:49:13 PMGood Idea creepy crawler.That makes sense.Next time I will try it that way. It will still lock the diff without tieing down the axles to one certain position. You should share more of your secrets with us.....

[tractorman]

Also have you tried a spider gear box?




 
This method requires a little grinding for the extra gears to fit.
But when you do this method you need to buy the same spider gears that were originally in bull gear shaft.

[tntchitwood]

I haven't tried it. I am still fairly new to locking rearends, but have been fabricating for years. The "spider gear box" violates my keep it simple rule, requiring me to buy and modify more parts. 
  What are the benefits of this method as apposed to welding what you already have? I am not totally against bending my #1 rule if the results are worth it.

[MTDrider1160]

Well i dont have to worry about locking that foote anymore.  Tonight i acquired 10transaxles, 1tranny, about 30 engines(no joke folkes).  And most of the transaxles are peerless, i know one is a 900 or a 600 not sure which one.

[tntchitwood]

But?!?! You lucky sucker!

[Chris]

Well i dont have to worry about locking that foote anymore.  Tonight i acquired 10transaxles, 1tranny, about 30 engines(no joke folkes).  And most of the transaxles are peerless, i know one is a 900 or a 600 not sure which one.

Pics or ban!!!

[tractorman]

Okay, The good part of this is no welding. All you need is a little grinding in order to make it fit. OOOOOO>> My mistake there is required a little welding. You need to weld the spiders to the bull gear. (O on a side note you dont have to weld the spider gears in the box it is just for extra safety muesure)    But the good thing is that is is more durable then welding steel to cast. No need to weld the axles. SOOOO.......... being more reliable you can just pound this tranny into the ground on rock pavement and so on.

Well i dont have to worry about locking that foote anymore.  Tonight i acquired 10transaxles, 1tranny, about 30 engines(no joke folkes).  And most of the transaxles are peerless, i know one is a 900 or a 600 not sure which one.

 !!!!!!!!!!!!!! do you have any 11 hp briggs and any 12 hp cranks in that mix of engines?

O and does anyone have any extra 2 speed footes (with reverse) sitting around for cheap they want to get rid of?

[MTDrider1160]

Pics or ban!!!

Ill get pics later today.

 !!!!!!!!!!!!!! do you have any 11 hp briggs and any 12 hp cranks in that mix of engines?

Im going this afternoon to pick up as much as i can, ill let you know after i catalog all that i get.

[tractorman]

Alright thanks

[tractorman]

I have another question. Since I am using a foote now do I weld the spider gear son the shaft to the shaft and that pretty much just locked it up or do I need to weld the spider gears on the shaft and weld them to the gears in the bull gear? O and also cant you use a bernzomatic torch and some nickel alloy brazing rod to take place of welding? Wouldnt this cut out worrying about warping the shafts?

[tntchitwood]

You don't actually weld the gear to the axle, If you snap an axle, you couldn't change it then. The gears that spin inside the ring gear(the big gear should have 2 little gears that are mounted inside of it that spin) Just weld these 2 gears(the little ones) to the ring gear(big one) so they won't spin anymore. I am not familiar with the nickel brazing. Somebody mentioned that they built up their cam lobes with the stuff. If they can do that it should be alright in the rearend. I wonder about heating the gears though, I don't know if that will make them brittle or not. I try not to weld anymore on the gears than I have to for fear of making them brittle. Let us know how it goes.     Tom

[tractorman]

Yeah I built up my cam in the 8 hp kohler I was going to use. But thanks I will post progress in ym build when I get it done.

[MTDrider1160]

Those gears are cast and heating them actually helps the weld penetrate better, just make sure after you heat then weld to reheat gradually lowering the temperature, or stick it in an oven after welding and gradually turn it down and then just let it aircool.  But whatever you do DONT cool it down with water.

[mtd]

Also have you tried a spider gear box?




 
This method requires a little grinding for the extra gears to fit.
But when you do this method you need to buy the same spider gears that were originally in bull gear shaft.

Do you just stick the gears in there or do you half to weld them in to keep them there?

[Chris]

Just stick 'em in

[mtd]

Cool...And this is an effective way to lock it right?Like it wont let go any time soon will it?Because  my atlma build is also going to be something we hall sheds around the yard with at the shop.And it will all be on pavement.And dont worry bout speed when doing that.I do it in 1st gear mid throttle.

[Chris]

It's better than welding it!

[toxic_j_2007]

isn't that spider gearbox the setup guys over in heymow use to lock their t-axles? that pic looks familiar.

[Chris]

Yeah, that picture was from HeyMow